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2) Should the limiting criteria for shooters in Age Based categories be changed from the current “minimum qualifying age OR GREATER” to “between the ages of…”?
(e.g. Wranglers from 36-48; 49ers from 49-59; Seniors from 60-64; etc.)A YES vote would no longer allow a shooter to compete in Age Based categories below his/her actual age range.
Cowboy/Cowgirl category age range would end at 35 years of age.
The Junior (Buckaroo/ette and Young Gun) categories would NOT be affected.
A NO vote would leave the Age Based category restrictions unchanged.
e.g. Two shooters with adjustable-sighted revolvers & a 66 or 73 rifle:
-- A 65 yr old competitor currently has the option to sign up in FIVE Age Based categories:
Silver Senior, Senior, 49er, Wrangler or Cowboy;
-- A 26 yr old using those firearms only has ONE option: Cowboy).
Discussion item 2;
It was mentioned that some wanted to shoot lower categories because it was not as hurtful to get beat by a younger shooter.
With 98% of the shooters shooting for fun there was no need to make rules up for removing the options.
Some felt that age based categories were designed for the ages that the category was created for.
One comment was that an 18 year old shooter (inexperienced) that got beat by a 65 year old the dropped down in category, would turn off the new shooter.
Tex referenced that the Cowboy Category is “The” category . All shooters can shoot that category.
The additional categories offer an option where you are able to protect yourself somewhat in a category with people your own age.
Other’s were of the opinion that changing into lower categories was detrimental to the growth of the sport when older shooters move down to a category they can win in.
3) Should an “OPEN” category be added with NO RESTRICTIONS regarding gender, age, shooting style or propellant? This would provide a single category in which ANY shooter could register.
(Gunfighter-style competitors would have to comply with the current category regulations)
Discussion item 3;
If item 2 passes, and this item passed, there would be a place that all shooters could use as an option to shooting in their age based category..
This would be an approved by not an official category. (Not a mandatory offering at state level and above).
It was mentioned that some folks would choose this category knowing they would be shooting against all shooters that entered and it would encompass many good shooters.
Current SASS rules would apply and no new guns, equipment or accessories would be added.
It was also clarified that the category would include all shooting styles and they shooting style could be different on each stage.
Some felt that we did not need any more new classes.
Some felt the real problem was people changing categories after getting to a match.
It was asked that there be an open ladies category. It was clarified that there was no ladies Open Category.
The conversation wandered into a concern for shooters changing categories. This was mostly a problem when it was close to the match date and awards had already been purchased. Some wanted control over this and wanted a cut off on category changes.
Hipshot - Limits on category changes will be added to the match administration guidelines as an option for match directors for controlling category changes.
4) Should the “B” Western Category options be rewritten to allow for additional ladies costuming options?
A YES vote would have the ROC rewrite the BW requirements to include the suggested changes.
A NO vote would leave BW as is.
Discussion item 4;
The ladies were requested to respond first.
There were different opinions on wether there were enough items to select from. Some also felt that it would lead to new categories like Saloon Girl or other professions in the B Western era. Opinions and comment were varied and split down the middle by those that spoke on the subject.
Miss Tabitha is the sounding board for additional clothing items and documentation would be needed to verify authenticity.
Ladies commented that adding Towns Woman was appropriate for B-western.
Others commented that the limited number of clothing items was difficult for the ladies.
Some felt there were a lot of options. Any additional footwear, like moccasins, could give a competitive advantage.
Concern was expressed that saloon women costumes could put out an image we would not want.
5) Should the attached, proposed Category System be adopted?
NOTE: Some of the Ladies categories that have historically been ‘under populated’ at most annual matches are no longer on the “officially recognized” list.
Those have been replaced with FCGF, SGF, Cattle Baron, and 80+ (name as yet undetermined)
A Match Director will always have the OPTION to offer ANY additional categories; as well as the OPTION to change the minimum requirement for honoring a category.
(As modified with amendment)
NAME---------------------------AGE / STYLE------M/F----LADIES
Buckaroo/ette------------------13 & under---------X--------X
Junior-------------------------14-16--------------X--------X
Cowboy/Cowgirl-----------------17-35--------------X--------X
Wrangler-----------------------36-48--------------X--------X
Forty Niner--------------------49-59--------------X--------X
Senior-------------------------60-64--------------X--------X
Silver Senior------------------65-69--------------X--------X
Elder Statesman----------------70-74--------------X--------X
Cattle Baron-------------------75-79--------------X--------X
(name TBD)---------------------80+----------------X--------X
Duelist-------------------------------------------X--------X
Senior Duelist-----------------60+Duelist---------X--------X
GunFighter----------------------------------------X--------X
Senior Gunfighter--------------60+GF--------------X--------X
Frontier Cartridge--------------------------------X--------X
Frontier Cartridge Duelist------------------------X--------X
Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter---------------------X--------X
Frontiersman--------------------------------------X--------X
Classic Cowboy/Cowgirl----------------------------X--------X
B Western-----------------------------------------X--------X
------------------------------------COUNT------>-20-------20
Category Rules:
1. Categories listed are the "Official" SASS categories.
2. All categories must be initially offered at State and above level matches.
3. MDs are NOT required to honor categories that fail to secure a minimum of 5 entries at the State and Regional level, or a minimum of 10 entries at WR and EOT.
A cutoff deadline shall be established and posted by the sponsoring club.
4. Match application forms should ask for a shooter's second (or third) choice.
5. If it becomes necessary to drop any category due to a failure to meet the minimum number of shooters required, those effected shooters will be placed into their second choice category. If no second choice has been given, "Age" based category shooters will “Rollback" into the next lower category.
The only exception is the Cowboy category. Since it is at the bottom of the scale, it will roll forward into the Wrangler category if necessary.
The Junior categories are exempt.
6. Shooters will not be allowed to compete in an "Age" based category that is outside of their age group, except in the case of a category "Rollback"
7. At the MD discretion, ANY category may be added, and any minimum requirement may be reduced.
8. These rules apply to state and above matches, and are recommended at all lower level matches.
9. OPEN category is any age/shooting style/propellant w/SASS-legal CAS equipment.
Discussion item 5;
The intent of the item is an attempt to see if it is broken, does it need change.
A motion was made and passed to reinstate Grand Dame to the list.
Lady TG’s expressed that the ladies categories were not represented equally in the category offerings.
It was expressed that ladies categories should mirror all mens categories.
Tex asked, is it a problem with the minimum entry numbers required? If so, how low should the entrant numbers be?
Hipshot, the minimum number of entrants requirement was an option for match directors to eliminate under utilized categories.
Much discussion followed, I mean a whole bunch!
Much discussion on the general concept that we had to many categories now. A few really don’t care how many categories we have.
A suggestion was made to keep the current category structure as the SASS Official categories and any new categories be added as SASS Approved categories.
Comment was made that we have a lot more men shooters than ladies shooters. It would be inappropriate to have an even match of categories.
A Motion was made and approved to amend agenda item number 5 to mirror all of the proposed categories for ladies.
This would create several new categories and the final total of categories would be 40.
FRIDAY Open 9:00 AM
Hipshot-Results of the votes will be available Saturday morning and they will be posted on the SASS TG Wire along with the minutes of the TG Summit. Voting Results are listed below. It requires a 66% vote to be passed.
Hipshot-Regional and State match residency requirements, when a shooter has multiple residences, are the state if residence is determined by your drivers license. By law you can only have one drivers license.
Active military personnel use the home of record.
At Winter Range the winner must be American citizen. At EOT, the winner can live anywhere in the world.
PaleWolf Brunelle,
RO Committee:
PaleWolf Brunelle, gave a report on some new RO Committee clarifications. His report is below. Changes are marked with the strike outs.
The RO Committee is also reviewing the use of elastic on shotgun belts.
The RO committee will review the capping of percussion cylinders outside of the gun and the penalty for dropping a capped cylinder.
Motion was made to accept the RO committee recommendations. Approved.
Range Operations Committee Discussion/Clarification Agenda – 2011 TG Summit --
1. CLARIFICATION of the rules re: DE-COCKING:
(As posted on the SASS Wire(s) on 26 October 2011)
7. De-cocking may not be done to avoid a penalty if cocked at the wrong time, position or location once a round has gone down range. NO gun may be de-cocked on the firing line except by pointing it down range and pulling the trigger or while under the direct supervision of a stage officer/Timer Operator. The penalty for de-cocking is a Stage Disqualification.
SHB p.23 / RO1 p.16
"Under the direct supervision" requires the TOs acknowledgement in an instructive or affirmative manner.
In other words there must be a positive indication to the shooter that the TO is giving his approval for the shooters action.
2. RE: NAVY PEPPERBOX REVOLVER
Noting that it is assembled on a "Colt Navy frame it qualifies as a MAIN MATCH revolver & thus is DISqualified as a "Pocket Pistol" (regardless of barrel length).
3. RE: .38 S&W SPL is LEGAL for PLAINSMAN sidematches
(originally introduced in 1899 as a blackpowder round)
4) BASIC RULES FOR THE LONG RANGE COMPETITIONS (SHB p. 18 bullet #4)
Optical and receiver mounted sights are not allowed.
EDIT for CLARIFICATION:
Receiver mounted sights are not allowed. OPTICAL sights are only allowed in that category.
5) ROC ruling: NO to the use of a 12ga/.70cal "slug gun" in SASS Long Range RIFLE sidematches. Shotguns using slugs are NOT legal as a RIFLE.
6) There is a mobile app being used DURING Long Range sidematches to calculate info for sight adjustment. (Real time info, including elevation, temperature, humidity, etc inputs combined with preset individual firearm/ammo data). One person punches in the numbers & provides the adjustment info to the shooter. Shooter v.1.6.2.8
In addition to rangefinders, the use of this or any similar device is a Sidematch DQ.
7) BISLEY HAMMER on a Ruger OLD ARMY percussion revolver?
SBHK hammers on a ROA are OK under the current “Firearms Covenants”.
Lower and/or wider hammers on percussion revolvers fall under the same allowance as for cartridge pistols. BISLEY hammers (modified or not) installed on ANY revolver without the BISLEY gripframe are still NOT ALLOWED.
8) Clarification re: Ammunition-related “Outlawed/illegal” items will be covered under:
The “Use of illegally-acquired ammunition” penalty.
9) There is no prohibition re: wearing a rifle/pistol ammo slide over SG loops on an ammo belt (as there is in regard to a SHOTSHELL ammo slide),
Sewing the loops directly to a shotshell loop on either a slide or belt is acceptable.
10) Handbook edit (due to oversight):
ADD single-shot shotguns to PLAINSMAN sidematch rules.
SHB p.17
11) Handbook edit (clarification): re OCTAGON BARRELS on REVOLVERS:
BARRELS
…
● Original barrels may be replaced with new barrels of correct styles (e.g., round, octagon, or half-round) for that particular TYPE firearm.
SHB p.4
12) EDIT:
Dropped round/ firearm – a round/ firearm that has left the shooter’s control and come to rest at a location or position other than where it was intended.
RO1 "Glossary of Terms" p.30
13) CLARIFICATION: what is meant by "in hand" as applied to loaded revolvers?
The following was posted (March 2011) on the TG, RO, and ROC Wires (to be added to the next edit of the RO1 "Glossary of Terms") :
"REVOLVER IN HAND" is defined as it applies to:
Holstered = Muzzle clear of the mouth of the holster (i.e. "out of leather")
Staged = Muzzle no longer in contact with the surface of the initial staging point
...this provides the same allowance for a 'full grip' on the second (loaded) revolver while firing the first no matter how/where the revolver(s) start on the stage.
Once the muzzle clears the holster or all contact is broken with the prop, the shooter is in violation if not registered as a GF or BW competitor.
Results for 2011 Meeting of SASS Governors
Action Shooter Items
Item #1 For 235=82.75% -- Against 48=16.90% -- Abstain 1=.035% PASS
Item #2 For 112=39.44% -- Against 170=59.86% -- Abstain 2=.070% FAIL
Item #3 For 130=45.77% -- Against 152=53.52% -- Abstain 2=.070% FAIL
Item #4 For 182=64.08% -- Against 100=35.62% -- Abstain 2=.070% FAIL
Item #5 For 148=52.11% -- Against 136=47.89% -- Abstain 0=.00% FAIL
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